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Man, that’s really gay

May 26, 2007

Mainstream Christianity will never accept gay marriage and neither will the Church. The whole discussion over gay marriage and civil unions in America can become extremely hurtful and convoluted by religion, and I might add, needlessly. America is a nation of many faiths and many beliefs. You can attend a church, mosque, synagogue, shrine, or you can stay at home. Churches and religious organizations should do what they do best, care for the poor, help in relief efforts after a disaster, and save souls. Save the souls that want to be saved and render the rest unto Caesar.”And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s. And they marvelled at him.”

Apparently this instruction is so important that it’s listed in all four of the Gospels. There are things in life that belong in the religious sphere and there are things that belong solely in politics. Please do not confuse the two. In the Muslim world apostates are condemned to death. Victims of rape are killed by male relatives, sometimes in the public square, in order to defend the family’s honor. Do we need any more reasons to keep our religious mores out of the public business? Just as we wouldn’t want Sharia law to replace our Constitution we should not let the Proclamation on the Family dictate our political conscience.

I mean, my God, until 29 years ago, Black males weren’t even allowed to hold the Priesthood. We had to wait. We had to wait for a revelation from God in order for us to see African Americans as equals. We had to wait for a sign from heaven, which the Book of Mormon teaches is adulterous, in order for us to do the right thing. Before that, Mormon apologists were using the curse of Cain to defend the decision of the Church to denying Black men the priesthood authority to bless their own families. And just as if by magic, 15 white men received a “revelation” from God in 1978, only a decade or two behind the Civil Rights movement. Please. Keep religion out of the gay marriage issue. It would serve us well to be reminded from time to time that Christ did not come to Judea to establish a political kingdom but a holy one.

Traditional marriage faces no threat from gay marriage. The sorry state of marriage is the doing of heterosexual couples. Half of temple marriages end in divorce. Are gay couples to blame? If you want to start defending marriage, start with your own, please. Weak families with heterosexual parents at the helm are the failures of heterosexual parents. Let’s not pass on the buck to homosexual couples. It’s easy to blame the boogeyman. Many gay people were raised by heterosexual parents. It would be ridiculous to blame the parents for the flamboyantly straight lifestyle that has so obviously corrupted their children and turned them gay.

Society ought to commend any couple who make a commitment to each other and keep it, be they gay or straight. Good people of any stripe will love their children and teach them right from wrong and teach them ethics. Let them do so.

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5 comments

  1. No, sorry. Children have an inherent right to be born into a family with both a mother and a father. This may not be possible in all cases, as it is the ideal. However, our laws should reflect and protect the ideal and not be based on the least common denominator.

    NPR had a piece last week saying that many Gays now want to be referred to as Queer. According to the piece, those that considered themselves Gay don’t like how the Gay movement is being mainstreamed. They liked being on the fringe. The Gay parades arn’t as wild and fun anymore. These people could care less about civil unions or gay marriage.


  2. Josh,

    You undermine your argument with the shots you take against the Church. I’m still trying to figure what point you were trying to make by shoe-horning in the revelation on blacks and the priesthood into this discussion. Are you implying that the Church was wrong then so it’s wrong now? In any event, while many members have questions as to why the policy against blacks holding the priesthood was allowed to perpetuate so long, I think you drastically mischaracterize the circumstances surrounding the revelation. You should take a look at Ed Kimball’s recent book Lengthen Your Stride. on his father, Spencer W. Kimball’s presidency. The book accompanying CD (which includes hundreds of pages of material that Deseret Book had editorial differences on and wanted to cut) has a wealth of information about what led up to the revelation and really gives the reader a sense of how it happened.

    Back to the issue of gay marriage. First, you have your facts mixed up. Half of temple marriages do NOT end in divorce. The rate of all Mormon divorces (mixed faith, non-temple, and temple) is around the national average, but the temple divorce rate is markedly lower (while the mixed faith divorce rate is markedly higher). Secondly, I think you would have made a stronger argument for your overall point (that “Society ought to commend any couple who make a commitment to each other and keep it, be they gay or straight. Good people of any stripe will love their children and teach them right from wrong and teach them ethics”) without attacking the Church the way you do in your 3rd and 4th paragraphs. Criticizing in the way you have makes the reader more likely to think you have an ax to grind so they take what you’ve written with healthy dose of salt. You can disagree with a Church policy without being disrespectful and when you do you’re much more likely to persuade than you otherwise would be.


  3. “NPR had a piece last week saying that many Gays now want to be referred to as Queer. According to the piece, those that considered themselves Gay don’t like how the Gay movement is being mainstreamed. They liked being on the fringe. The Gay parades arn’t as wild and fun anymore. These people could care less about civil unions or gay marriage.”

    Broz – I didn’t hear the NPR piece, but I have grave suspicions that you are not accurately reflecting it in your comments. Perhaps some gay individuals do like being on the fringe and living wild lives, but then again, so do a whole lot of straight people. I’m not sure, however, how you justify stereotyping so broadly a pretty diverse group of people like “those who consider themselves gay”. Your comments make me doubt whether you have had much experience with anyone who is gay. Whether you agree that gay individuals should have the right to marry or obtain civil unions, to claim “These people could care less about civil unions or gay marriage” is pretty indefensible. To rebut your point with a couple of anecdotal Mormon examples that have colored my views on the issue, first my childhood neighbor across the street (son of our Relief Society president growing up) has been in a committed monogamous gay relationship for going on 10 years now. They both wear rings and consider themselves married. They both have doctorates now and live quiet lives (far from the decadent caricature your comment portrays). Similarly, my Sophomore year prom date (who parents both work at BYU) has been in a monogamous gay relationship for 4 years now and is planning on having a “partnership” ceremony this summer. She and her partner are also highly educated (both have masters) and are not wild partiers.

    I think in debating these issues here, we should seek to raise the level of discourse a little. There is sure to be disagreement on these contentious issues, but I believe we can debate the merits here while still according to those with whom we disagree a measure of good will and without resorting to unfounded stereotypes.


  4. The point of the NPR piece was precisely that gay culture, given broader acceptance in society, has indeed moved away from the promiscuous counterculture that it used to be, and that *a few* gays are nostalgic for the wild and woolly bathhouse days. It seems to me that we ought to be delighted that more gays now feel accepted enough to settle into the mainstream and live in committed and fulfilling relationships.

    Here’s the link, for anyone who wants to check the accuracy of mine or BRoz’s report: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=10231431


  5. Thanks Kristine



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